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Good afternoon, everybody, and welcome.

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I'll begin today by acknowledging the traditional
custodians of the land that I'm presenting

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from today, the Ngunnawal and Ngambri people, and
I pay my respects to elders past and present.

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I'd also like to acknowledge the thousands of
years of storytelling and art creation

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that have taken place upon these lands.

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My name is Tara from the National Portrait Gallery,
and I welcome you all to our virtual

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highlights tour, NPPP at Yarra Ranges.

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For those in the know, NPPP stands for our
National Photographic Portrait Prize,

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and today we're discussing the National
Photographic Portrait Prize 2022.

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So whilst we're a buzz with news of NPPP 2023,
our '22' exhibition is currently touring

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around regional venues in Australia.

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Our little housekeeping, please mute your mics
and turn on your cameras if you feel

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comfortable.

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Also, any questions you have or comments or introduce
yourself, pop it in our chat box,

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and we hope to have time at the end of the session
to address as many questions as we

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can.

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So today, our panel discussion is led by Madeline
Rees, or Maddie Rees, who is the Museum's

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Exhibitions Curator at Yarra Ranges
Regional Museum in Victoria.

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Maddie is joined by Ayman Kaake, who is an
NPPP '22 finalist and an award-winning

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Lebanon-born Australian-based photomedia artist
in Melbourne, and Joey Chan, also an NPPP

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'22 finalist, who is a portrait photographer
based in Melbourne, who appreciates beauty

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and the ordinary, and her practice tells
visual stories of everyday people.

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Thanks for joining us, guys, and I'll hand
over to Maddie to begin the panel.

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Thank you.

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Thank you so much, Tara.

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Before we get going, I'd also like to take this
moment to respectfully acknowledge the

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traditional owners of the lands that I'm joining
you from today, which is Wurundjeri Wurrung

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Country, and I'd like to take my respects to Aboriginal
community elders past and present

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who have resided in the area and have been an
integral part of the history of the Yarra

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Rangers region.

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I'm really excited to be talking with Joey and
Ayman today about their works in the NPPP

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2022, currently on display in Lilydale
in regional Victoria.

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What I really love about the NPPP and the tour
is that the portrait gallery allows

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each venue to reinterpret the hang, which gives
an opportunity for curators such as

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myself to find our own connection with the works.

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As Sandra Bruce discusses this in her exhibition
catalog essay in reference to the audience,

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and what she says of the portrait is that we
observe, we explore, we recognise, learn

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and wonder.

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A good portrait will ensure that in some way we
connect, which is why I've chosen to talk

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with Joey and Ayman today.

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So before we kick off, I will just remind everyone
we will have an opportunity at the

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end to ask a few audience questions.

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So just pop them in the chat and I'll keep track
of them throughout this discussion.

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So Joey, we'll start with you, but would you like
to introduce us to your practice before

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we get onto your work in the portrait prize?

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Certainly.

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Hi everyone.

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So lovely to be here.

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Thanks for the welcome.

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So a bit about me.

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I've been taking photos for about 12 years, but
it was only really the last three, I think

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coming out of lockdown, that I really honed in on
what I wanted to do and why I love photography

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and also really focused on my style, the subjects
and I guess with a camera, the types of stories

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I wanted to tell.

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I also fell in love with film photography and
I picked up some old vintage cameras,

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the old school film days.

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I think recently has had a bit of a resurgence,
but I think my first film camera was probably

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around 10 years ago.

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I love the process of film and I think that
has been a big part of my photography and

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being able to connect with my subjects,
especially in my portrait work.

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I guess when I think about photography, I've realised
recently that my passion isn't really

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photography.

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It's about people.

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I've forever been really curious about people,
why they do what they do, how they think and

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I think coming into photography was just an excuse
to connect with people with a camera

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and it's kind of a ticket for me to speak with people
and have their permission to understand

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them, talk to them and build that
rapport and trust with them.

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That's kind of my big focus
is really about people.

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I might go to some of my recent
work which highlights this.

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The first two photos of my friend Samar, I only
met her probably around a year ago and

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through the camera I was able to uncover she's
this amazing woman from Yemen and her just

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describing what life was like as a woman in Yemen and
her search for creativity and self-expression

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which was a very difficult back home for her.

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I can't describe the experience.

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It doesn't quite do it justice but because of
having just spent a lot of time with her

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she was able to reveal who she was to me in
front of the camera so that was something

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that I think is very meaningful to me.

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The other project I've been working on and is
around just taking photos of strangers

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really, centred around this place
called Section 8 in Melbourne.

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So just picked a few but I started just to -
well, it's my favourite bar in Melbourne.

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I don't know if you've heard of it or know about
it but the people that come to this

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place is very eclectic, they're diverse and very
- I just found this place so interesting

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because I'm originally from Brisbane.

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One of the things that for me that challenged
my practice was actually just taking photos

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of strangers which is daunting for anybody
but I had my film camera.

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I had maybe five minutes with someone typically
and to build that rapport in a really short

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amount of time.

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That was a personal challenge and I think the
results are something that I'm quite proud

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of and hoping to make this into a more substantial
piece of work so it's an ongoing project.

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Yeah, that's me in a nutshell.

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Amazing, thank you.

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So, my hand over to you but do you want to introduce
us to yourself and your practice

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as well?

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Hello everyone.

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My name is Ayman Khaki and I'm Lebanese and
I moved to Australia in 2011 to continue

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my study in engineering or at least that's
my mom thought I was doing because I was

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doing visual art.

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I didn't tell her till after five years when I
sent her this little thing to her and then

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inside there was images of the one that I created
to show her the landscape, how I felt

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when I was away from home and I start actually
in drawings and printmaking and then after

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that I bought my first camera in 2015 and I
start realising or photographing what I

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was sketching and documenting my feeling of isolation,
being away from my siblings and

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because I'm one of 12 so there was a lot of stories
happening in the house so it's kind

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like in self-portrait documenting
feelings and emotions.

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This is how I started and then once I finalised that
Australia is my second home and not feeling

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homesick I moved from documenting my feelings
to documenting another stories that might

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be social, political, humanitarian such like working
with refugees or working with women

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that flee their countries or migrate to here to provide
better life for their kids and normally

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I work with everything like I do film, analogue
or digital, I do videos as well and plus I

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take calligraphy and lockdown was tough in Melbourne
for lockdown so I taught how to

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serve and how to do embroidery as well with the
help of my mum and my brother in Abu Dhabi.

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And did those skills, new skills of sewing and
that, have they really kind of inspired

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your work for the portrait prize as well?

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That was actually my first attempt
of sewing that Birka in further.

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Amazing.

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So this is Ayman's self-portrait and so both
Ayman and Joey's works are kind of dealing

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with themes of migration and strong female matriarchal
women in their lives so Ayman do

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you want to discuss this work for us
in greater detail if possible?

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Yeah it's actually a random inspiration because
during lockdown we didn't stop working and

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I was working with my friend Daha and she's a
woman and we were like doing wrapping some

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stuff at the sweet shop and then we were talking
stories and stuff and then she told me she

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wanted to go to pray because we have a smaller
prayer room in our place and women they have

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to wear prayer clothing and normally it's white
or blue like a plain and then I went

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and I saw her wearing this leopard print prayer
clothes and I asked her what happened to the

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white and plain blue and she told me we evolved
honey and then she told me if we have to wear

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it why not for our own voice and it was so inspiring
that the second day I just went

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and I purchased the fabric and then I have a
sewing machine that I bought from Facebook

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marketplace which has problems so I dialed my
brother and Abu Dhabi told him because

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he's a fashion designer and I told him what happened
here and then he told me where to

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put the threads and everything and then during the
cutting I was calling my mom for more than

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two hours and tell her what I was doing and stuff
so we kind of like felt the family project

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but everyone in different countries and actually like
this made in one day from the whole fabric

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and everything but the short was it took only five
minutes for like a full day preparation

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for five minutes first and I was like I think that's
it and I showed my mom and my brother

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was like my mom she told me at least this is
not a nude photo which is going on so yeah

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so that's it and now like I actually I took photos
of all the prayer clothing in a different

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pattern to create a whole series of the whole
like thing I think we've got other photos

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of some works from that series as well we might
be able to bring up as hopefully in a

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minute yes the polka dot incredible and it's all
made like in my kitchen next to the sink

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so it looks like a big space but it's actually it's
in the kitchen and was this photographed

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in lockdown as well some of them in lockdown some
of them like just lockdown amazing and

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are there any other works from your practice you
want to share at this point too Ayman I

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think there was there was one with the embroidery yeah
I did and this was a finance at the Islamic

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Museum and won the prize and at CCP which is
like I put it in a frame let's see if you

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can get that one up in a minute yeah so this is
when I start doing embroidery on photographs

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and plus including some different technique
to it to make it more handmade yeah other

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than just photograph because I'm opposite of
Joey I'm afraid to ask strangers to take

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the photos like I will have a heart attack if
I want to go it's like can I take it but

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I was like it's I can't do it I don't know
how she's doing she's a special art that

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approaching strangers for for works I think even
in some of these discussions that happens

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as well maybe Joey will go to your work the
portrait of your grandmother before we go

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over could we just bring up Ayman's work we actually
need to know the title of the work

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to share it so we can visit lockdown and that's
lock up the lockdown not lock up thank you

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yeah that's the one so beautiful stunning so
yeah that's the during lockdown and just

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in the study I was like how there is more domestic
violence especially when they have

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to be locked up in the same house where the the
females are beaten or domestic violence

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violated and this is in like homage to them and
especially because a man wearing a book

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and speaking about this issue just like to raise
awareness about them being feminism

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it's not a war between men and women and the
discussion should be included with the two

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genders absolutely absolutely thank you Ayman
I'm Joey let's talk about your grandmother

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so this is a really personal portrait as well as
like Ayman's and this is someone you have

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an approach to do you want to talk about yes no
no stranger here so in in Chinese culture

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like the children look after parents especially
when they get older and my grandma lived with

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us for as long as I can remember and so she was
a big part of my life growing up and you

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know I'd I know you know bits and pieces I
mean she wasn't a big share actually she

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kind of just like you know got on with things and
but what I knew was obviously like coming

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from you know 30s 40s 50s life was really tough
she had to raise five children on her own

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she was widowed as a you know she was young widow
and ever since I guess we migrated to

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Australia I think she's always held that kind of
mentality and I always kind of wanted her

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to enjoy herself because you know she doesn't you
know very very privileged to be in Australia

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and but I just I don't know I was always in
awe of how you know how tough she was she

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always presented very very tough she never complained
or anything and I think that the

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photos the portraits of her started after she
survived pneumonia in 2018 it just felt

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like you know I think when you go through that
especially with such a close family member

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it kind of makes you realise that you just have
this extra time like what you know time

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like if you know she's still with us so what can
we do now what what conversation what do

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I need to ask her you can you want to make the
most of that time you have with them so

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we're really lucky we have we had a few more years
with her but I made it a thing for us

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between her and I that I take a photo why I
you know record little videos and I put

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on Instagram is because she was hilarious she
just didn't understand this generation

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and why did I dye my hair why my jeans were ripped
or anything like that so it just became

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a real funny and bonding experience for us
but so yeah every time I visited her and

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Brisbane I would just yeah take a photo and I
happened to have my medium format camera

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with me in this instance and it was also the
last portrait I took of her so after that

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I went back to Melbourne and unfortunately she
passed a few months after that so yeah

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it just kind of you know a beautiful way in a
very I guess unintended way to commemorate

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her and through the N triple P you know being
selected as well so I feel like she's she's

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still with us and she's you know really looked
after me yeah like that's kind of yeah the

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story behind it it's like a smile and have fun
really because she was awesome you just

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want to shake her because she's always so serious
again I think that's grandmother's

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role sometime is to be serious and to care for
you when you're making silly decisions

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and I mine mine was like that as well but it's
such a nice thought that both your works

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of you know it's traveled extensively kind of
around the country for the past 12 months

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and we're kind of coming towards the end of
this tour one thing about this prize I've

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noticed is that you know there's so much more
diversity on the walls than there have been

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previously I worked on the 2012 national NPPP at
a previous venue and yeah it's the diversity

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of people in front of and behind the camera as
well so how let anyone I might start with

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you but how do you feel the portrait prize and
entering it and and it's to her being

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a finalist has really shaped or changed your experience
of exhibiting and potentially making

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works like do you make works now with with the
prize in mind I used to make works just

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for the prizes but then I felt like I'm limited
myself and limited what I want my intention

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of my work so now I'm making my work and see if
it fits the price on that and this is how

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artists should work but being a finalist like
this image I took in 2021 was still talking

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to that like at the same image till 2023 because
it's touring and because they gave her long

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they gave the photo longer lives and this is
what national portrait gallery is their

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gallery is doing at the moment giving these
images these stories longer life which is

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amazing and so yeah I was happy to be a finalist
and you get to travel around and you popped

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out here for the launch but has it offered you
opportunities to connect with other artists

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as well a man yeah there's a lot of national community
they now they reach out to me and

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tell me their stories and even offer me like
if like tell me the story personal stories

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which is really good and the plus offer me a
different platform like and the rate is

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to look at my work at the same time as well and
even like offer me some space to exhibit

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my work which is really great and I'm like I'm
having another solo exhibition for the

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same year like I had a three solo exhibition
because of the exposure star had from the

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national portrait prize and being winning other
competition at the same time as your

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and I'm just asking you know the question and has
your practice evolved are you photographing

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other people as well now within that or just still
sell portrait the new series I'm photographing

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close friends which is called 99 names about the
criminalization of homosexuality in more

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than 74 countries and this is started as a solo
exhibitions hosted by Midsummer festival

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and represent at Brunswick Street Gallery as
part of the main prizes and then the same

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one it's going to be shown at Edge Gallery in
Maldon so this is one of the photos the

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blackstrike which is involved a lot of cultural
references and and telling the story about

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a hypocrisy and politics society
and put in a name of religion.

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Wow incredible and black and white as well.

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Tell them black and white it's actually the
photos behind me just like the selections

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about where I'm going to put everything in the
gallery and it's going to be in the opening

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will be in September at Maldon.

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Wonderful and Joey how do you feel the portrait prize
has potentially changed your perspective

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or open it up to the audience given that you know
this photo of your grandmother is striking

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emotion is what I can say when I saw it having
recently lost my own Nana how do you feel

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it's affected your practice or?

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Yeah well first I think I take a lot of inspiration
from amazing artists like Ayman so it's like

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really awesome to be able to connect with so
many other photographers and just to speak

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to them about their creative practice.

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For me like it was like I'd still consider myself
like very new to photography and I'm

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constantly thinking about you know how do we
how do I connect with people through my

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work and how how do people you know feel what
I felt in the moment by you know seeing my

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work and so it's really humbling and amazing to
hear like you know that that does you know

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reach more people and that people give great
feedback that they do feel something maybe

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it reminds them of a family member
or their grandparents.

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I guess things like that just like makes me it's
very encouraging and gives me the confidence

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as well to kind of keep doing what I'm doing
because it's really easy to look at other

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people's work and feel like you know that you
might be doing something wrong or I guess

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yeah you kind of especially with social media kind
of susceptible to a lot of outside influence

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but I guess yeah having having piece of work
part of the internal prepay just being on

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such a massive stage I guess and platform to
be shared around is really yeah really

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amazing and yeah very very grateful
for that for the experience.

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Yes we are a society very kind of flushed with
images at the moment and you know the

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portrait prize alone I believe had almost two
and a half thousand entries and you know

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both of you are obviously very strong being the
finalists so congratulations and I might

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open it up to questions from the audience now
so if anyone does have any questions just

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pop it in the chat.

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I have noted that we have one from me to Laura and
they have asked a question directed towards

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you in the they're curious about the gloves
in your images in your self-portrait.

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It depends because there is two gloves so one
of the gloves in lock up not lock down it's

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our used the gloves they're using when you're
cleaning the house as a part of like a two

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great domestic and in leopard print it's just
the red gloves is just to get the themes

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about my mum because she used to plant a lot and
use gloves so I kind of get this inspiration

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from it and the gloves that I'm wearing is just
I don't want to show my hairy hands that's

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all but I go to savers a lot and lots of vintage
and I think I have a lot of gloves you will

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see them in photos hopefully.

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I love a good savers find.

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Yeah amazing.

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Anyone else having questions they'd like to
ask the others don't be shy pop it in the

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chat.

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Yes so I will just quickly cycle so right behind
me in the gallery so I'm currently

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seeing in the box at the Yarra regional museum
we've got Ayman's work here and then

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if we head round the corner a little bit we can
see Joey's grandmother just down there

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so we're very excited to have
the court surprise here.

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I don't think we're going to get any other questions
but Ayman, Joey thank you so much

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for chatting with us today,
chatting with me today.

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Thank you.

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Thanks for having us.

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And thanks to everyone for joining us I really
encourage you all to if you live in Victoria

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to pop out Lilydale it's a really great place
you know we're kind of like the gateway to

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the Yarra Valley and the hills and it's beautiful
season at the moment but thank you also to

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Tara and the National Portrait Gallery for hosting
us today they've been such an amazing

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team to work with and I'm sure Ayman and
Joey very much sing their praises too.

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So yes thank you.

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Tara back over to you.

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Thanks Maddie and thank you to
our wonderful panellists.

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I'd also like to thank our online community for
joining us today for this discussion I

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hope you enjoyed it and you can further check out
both Joey and Ayman's work and the Yarra

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Rangers on the links will pop at the end.

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I really enjoyed the discussion into your guys
contemporary practices and the discussion

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as well around culture and family
which is really important.

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So thank you everyone.

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I hope everyone also joins us next Tuesday as
we focus on some of the bespectacled beings

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which is a real tongue twister in our collection
on the 18th of July virtual highlights to

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our girls who wear glasses.

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We'll see you all online then.

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