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(ethereal music)

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<v ->Well, you're all rugged up, mate.</v>

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<v ->I live here.</v>

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<v ->I've come down to warm you up.</v>

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<v ->Have you?</v>

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<v ->With conversation and my presence. (laughs)</v>

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(ethereal music continues)

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<v ->I'm trying to work out, Jack.</v>

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<v ->Yeah.</v>

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<v ->Exactly where we met.</v>

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But it's a bit hard, because I think we met

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more through the milieu

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certainly through the milieu of theatre

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and the Brand Factory mob.

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<v ->Yeah.</v>

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<v ->So it's not a specific point,</v>

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but more mutual friends

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and the world of theatre, really.

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<v Jack>Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.</v>

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<v Rod>Yep.</v>

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<v ->I remember you picking me up one time</v>

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<v ->Mm-hm.</v>

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<v ->From Smith Street and say, "Come up to the-</v>

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<v ->"Come up, come to the loft."</v>

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<v ->"I made a home studio up there."</v>

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<v ->Yeah, yeah, yeah.</v>

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<v ->And so you took the first photograph.</v>

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<v ->First photograph, yep.</v>

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In those early days,

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even when I was working as an actor at the Brand Factory,

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I'd just come from my first exhibition at Brummels.

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And already I was starting to hone my portraiture

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into a particular,

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quite personal structure,

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but also I was more far more intrigued

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by some of the more stark, very direct portraits

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from early on in portraiture in the 19th century.

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Now, there was a starkness and directness

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which came from the slow shutter speeds.

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They had no alternative.

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There was no spontaneity possible.

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You had to sit still and look into the camera,

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and for long periods of time.

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So I found that look into the camera

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so quietly intense.

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And there was nothing periphery around it.

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It was of such a direct engagement into the lens,

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through the lens, through the photographer,

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to the person viewing.

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A really powerful, singular connection.

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And that intrigued me much more than, say,

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trying to make whatever,

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someone look good this way or that way,

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or construct the image.

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I really liked that.

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So anyhow, come to the time

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where I'd had my first show over in Brummels.

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I was working with the actors in the Brand Factory.

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My milieu was spreading over to this sort of territory,

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and I started to systematically do portraits

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of my peers-

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fellow actors, writers, junkies, whatever we were into.

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(Jack chuckles)

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And that's how Jack would've come into that, too.

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So that's how he became part of that original series.

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<v Jack>Yes.</v>

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<v Rod>And that's how we really started</v>

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forming a friendship.

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And from then on, over the years,

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whenever Jack was in the area,

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he come up for a cup of tea.

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<v Jack>Yeah, yeah yeah.</v>

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<v ->Or he was coming back from on the hill,</v>

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where he'd been collecting the rent, so to speak-

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(Jack laughs)

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He'd pop in with his bags.

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<v ->Popping after a bit of time in Her Majesty's.</v>

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<v ->Yeah, yeah. Come 'round when he was out.</v>

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<v ->Of which I've got 22 mugshots of my own.</v>

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<v Rod>That's right!</v>

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<v ->In the archives.</v>

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And I'm very proud of them.

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<v Rod>Yeah.</v>

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<v ->We were talking about, Jack-</v>

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and, really, the only family album we had-

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<v ->Yes. (laughs)</v>

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<v ->Were the mugshots-</v>
<v ->The mugshots.</v>

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<v ->From times he did in jail over the years.</v>

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<v ->Yeah, I remember,</v>

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you used 17 of those 22 mugshots

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that I have in the Victorian archives.

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And just plastered one after the other.

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The many faces of me over the years.

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And I considered them,

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when I first saw the art,

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the equivalent of my missing childhood photographs

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that I never knew.

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(ethereal music)

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But that portraiture was the-

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we did celebrate it

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as a renewal, a refreshing

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<v Rod>Mm.</v>

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<v ->Of somebody in my unique position,</v>

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a survivor of the stolen generations.

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<v Rod>Mm.</v>

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<v ->And we hadn't made a big hullabaloo</v>

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about that in those days.

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<v Rod>Mm.</v>

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<v ->But indeed, I was a survivor.</v>

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<v Rod>Mm.</v>

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<v ->One of the acknowledged and well-known</v>

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indigenous survivors of the stolen generations.

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There were, of course, white kids that were stolen, too.

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<v Rod>Mm.</v>

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<v ->And I was lumped in with them in the Box Hill Boys' Home</v>

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as the only aboriginal feller in the Box Hill Boys' Home

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during my time there.

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So, reflecting on that face you see

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in that 2012, was it?

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Photographic Portraiture Prize-winning entry,

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because you could see, I saw myself in that photograph

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as a celebration of my longevity, my persistence

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in sticking with the art form that I love,

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treading the boards,

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fronting the camera.

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So I'm really proud of both of us for having done that.

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And I remember the times you wanted me to come up

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and just stand in front of that same wall,

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just to test out your focusing.

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Your ability to focus and all that.

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Take a snap or two, too.

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<v Rod>It's getting harder. It's getting harder.</v>

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(Jack chuckles)

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<v Jack>Yes.</v>

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<v Rod>Mm.</v>

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(ethereal music)

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<v ->Yeah. Well, so, that's been, you know,</v>

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that's been our relationship for a long time.

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I still drop in, checking you out.

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<v Rod>Yep.</v>

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<v ->Seeing how you are.</v>

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<v ->We have the odd coffee down at Rose's.</v>

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<v ->Yeah. Yes, yes.</v>

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<v Rod>So, yeah, we're definitely village elders</v>

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on Smith Street, that's for sure.

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<v Jack>Yeah. We're the elders. Yes, yes.</v>

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We're the song men of the Smith Street Strip.

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I'm the self-proclaimed feather foot, goodnight man,

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the law man of the Smith Street Strip, man beyond reproach.

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And everybody loves that, you know?

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<v Rod>Everybody loves that.</v>

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<v ->Because they've seen me at my worst on Smith Street.</v>

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And you plucked me out of that world,

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insisting on a strong relationship with me

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over all those years.

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And that portraiture that you've done

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shows a young elder in the making.

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That's what it does. That's what it is.

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You know, so that's what you've done.

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See where you've landed people?

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(Rod laughs)

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See how far you've taken me.

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<v ->I don't think my photographs have done that.</v>

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<v ->Well, it helps.</v>

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All these little initiatives,

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all these little bits and pieces

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are part of the journey of my rise to, well,

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from infamy to fame,

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(laughs) I like to say.

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That's been a blessing.

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<v ->Mm.</v>

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(ethereal music)

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<v ->I was a bit worried,</v>

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because there's quite a few events over two days.

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<v ->Right, yeah.</v>

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<v ->"How's Jack going to cope with all this?"</v>

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Didn't have to worry

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(Jack laughs)

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Chatting up people.

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One of them come up to me and said, "I love him so much.

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I wanna put him in my pocket and taking home with me."

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(Jack laughs)